Bwlchtocyn/Penrhyn Du Adits

BertyBasset

BertyBasset

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I've had a wander around here a few times, and not noticed any adits. Recently though, I noticed photos of an Old Day Level and a New Day Level on Wikipedia

1024px-Old_Day_Level.png

'Old Day Level'


1024px-New_Day_Level.jpg

'New Day Level'


Anyone know where these are located? Are there New and Old levels, or are they one and the same? There also seems to be yet another adit (hidden behind a rock) in Porth Bach. I might go for a recce this afternoon as I need to be in Pwllheli this evening.
 
Noticed these images, though not on wikipedia, about five years ago and asked about them locally. No-one seemed to know anything (or at least be willing to talk about them?) I asked Peter Masters, who is referenced in the linked article, as he had published some history back in the late 1990s when doing illustrasted talks about the area - he also didn't know anything about them. I have a vague memory of a gated adit near Frochas Fach 50 years ago which was somewhat similar to 'New Day Level'.
 
A mystery indeed. They do look a bit like Gilfach in Cwm Pennant, - I had pondered a hoax, although the entrance is a bit different, and Giflach entrance section with pick marks is more rectangular.

I think this is the article you refer to https://www.armchairhistory.co.uk/pdf/New-Lead2.pdf where the entrance is tentativelly labelled Pant Gwyn Adit? Pant Gwyn Mine is shown on the 1888-1913 1:10,560 map at SH 3086 2674 so could be somewhere around there. I've only had a look at the mines near the headland, not realising they extended towards Sarn Bach.
1731236405789.png
 
Looking at Bennett and Vernon's Metal Mines of Llanengan Figure 10 (p. 53), Old Day Level is at SH 3174 2636 and the New Day Level is near the beach at SH 3185 2650 - both shown on the 25" map of 1914. The photo of the Old Day Level above shows the entrance very much cleared from when I saw it in 2013.

Bennett and Vernon show "Trial Adit?" in Porth Bach at SH 323 264.
 
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Hi Dave,

Those grid refs sounds promising, Didn't get round to having a visit yesterday, but it's high on the list now.

Supprised I've not seen an account of a visit if it's as open as the photos suggest. I've seen confirmaton and photo of the Porth Bach adit somewhere, it appears to be hidden behind a rock, and quite low.

Robin
 
That pdf by Peter is newer than the notes he gave me back in 1997/8. I'll have a read.

New day level OSGB ref fits with my memory of being near Frochas Fach.

The OSGB ref for the 'trial adit' is not at Porth Bach? It would however 'fit' a point on the rocks where Mastermap shows 'Issues' so that's promising.
 
Reminds me, there was an audit (drainage?) only slightly further south on that coast, I saw from kayak. Pretty obvious, and if I remember, exactly west of the North most point of tyd west island. Exits sorted of middle of the slabs of cliff. Couldn't find any record for it, wish I'd got off and looked now
 
There is a cave marked on Mastermap around that position.
It's a bit far South for the mines but that's not to say someone didn't try their luck (or that the OS didn't mis-identify it).
 
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This is what I thought was the portal of the New Day Level, with the tramway running above it, when I visited in 2012.

Portal-Of-New-Day-Level_79691.jpg

Portal-Of-New-Day-Level_79692.jpg


Note that it was in the garden of a private property.
 
There are some traces of the Wikipedia photographer on Youtube and Facebook. Wonder if we can get contact details.
 
skimble said:
This is what I thought was the portal of the New Day Level, with the tramway running above it, when I visited in 2012.

Note that it was in the garden of a private property.
Click to expand...
From current OS mapping (OS Leisure layer) and the position of the slipway shown on it I think the location of these photos is SH 3178 2649. My location of SH 3185 2650 above was from the 1914 25" map. I was told (2013) that there is (or was) another way into this adit from somewhere close to the inland side of the tramway route more or less directly above the adit.

I'm not sure if the OS coordinates from the National Library of Scotland late 29th-early 20th century maps are exactly the same as modern coordinates – would anyone care to enlighten me?
 
The co-ordinate systems are the same but you have to bear in mind that anything small depicted on the map will not be shown precisely (footpaths are a good example of this - the OS try to ensure that footpaths show on the correct side of boundaries but a footpath was typically less than 2ft wide and a wall might be less scale those down to 1k25 - both marked and good enough for most general purposes).

Back to the gated entrance:
231861_326504.jpg

The numbers, bottom left are the 1m precision location of the entrance (for those who prefer the more common LLnnnnnn type format SH 31861 26504) not the map centre.

Note the three shafts (again, ignoring the size they are shown at as they can't be that big).

The latest 1m LIDAR probably wouldn't help much but typically there is a chunk missing which is just the bit we'd want. The 50cm LIDAR is only available for a few areas so far and obviously not this bit that we need! If available it might show other potential things that are hidden by foliage on the various aerial imagery available.

On to the 'trial adit'. Again, numbers bottom left are the adit not map centre. In this case the 'Issues' is significant as it means there is an opening of some sort from which water is coming.

232171_326428.jpg

So that leaves the 'Old Day Adit'. Looking at the first screengrab the location from the co-ordinates posted by Dave would put it left and above the leftmost shaft, around the corner of that same plot. Nothing shown on Mastermap but that isn't surprising as there would have to be recent arial data and the scar seen. Of course, because of the inherent imprecise nature of a marking of 'level' on an old map (remember, it is small so can't be marked precisely due to the map scales used in over the counter mapping) we'd need to look around a slightly bigger area on the ground.
 
I visited the Old day Adit this year. It is flooded, very silted up and blocked about 100m in. However the adit was well made and seems stable. Any further exploration would involve some serious digging and I guess the local council would need to be contacted regarding permission to do this. It would be dangerous after rain due to flooding.

The New Day Adit is on private property and the owner would have to give permission as it is in his back garden. To be fair perhaps we should probably use a shaft on higher ground that we could drop into to explore further. However I suspect much of it is now blocked through material being dropped down the shafts, silting up and flooding - the New day adit is also prone to flooding.

I wonder if the Trial Adit was a drainage adit - there is an adit concreted up with a 4" pipe at about that point. Nothing like a big enough effluent for a system this size which might explain the flooding in the New Day adit.

The system was very extensive in its heyday, but I think much of it was quite deep (below see level) and so now will be flooded if not collapsed or silted up. And even if not definitely technical cave diver area.

If anybody wanted to do some exploration of this system then please let me know. I usually visit once or twice a year in the Summer.
 
ilt said:
The co-ordinate systems are the same but you have to bear in mind that anything small depicted on the map will not be shown precisely (footpaths are a good example of this - the OS try to ensure that footpaths show on the correct side of boundaries but a footpath was typically less than 2ft wide and a wall might be less scale those down to 1k25 - both marked and good enough for most general purposes).

Back to the gated entrance:
View attachment 1289

The numbers, bottom left are the 1m precision location of the entrance (for those who prefer the more common LLnnnnnn type format SH 31861 26504) not the map centre.

Note the three shafts (again, ignoring the size they are shown at as they can't be that big).

The latest 1m LIDAR probably wouldn't help much but typically there is a chunk missing which is just the bit we'd want. The 50cm LIDAR is only available for a few areas so far and obviously not this bit that we need! If available it might show other potential things that are hidden by foliage on the various aerial imagery available.

On to the 'trial adit'. Again, numbers bottom left are the adit not map centre. In this case the 'Issues' is significant as it means there is an opening of some sort from which water is coming.

View attachment 1290

So that leaves the 'Old Day Adit'. Looking at the first screengrab the location from the co-ordinates posted by Dave would put it left and above the leftmost shaft, around the corner of that same plot. Nothing shown on Mastermap but that isn't surprising as there would have to be recent arial data and the scar seen. Of course, because of the inherent imprecise nature of a marking of 'level' on an old map (remember, it is small so can't be marked precisely due to the map scales used in over the counter mapping) we'd need to look around a slightly bigger area on the ground.
Click to expand...
The shafts are quite large openings. In the middle of gorse and quite hard to get to. Rigging to drop in might be a bit tricky. Might have to use the local vegetation.
 
The only record of a descent I've heard is that by Harold Morris - a shaft near Cornish Row I think. There was a snippet of text documentig it floating about in the early internet days, but I've not seen it since. Might be something in Versnon & Bennet, but I can't find my copy at the moment.
 
BertyBasset said:
I've had a wander around here a few times, and not noticed any adits. Recently though, I noticed photos of an Old Day Level and a New Day Level on Wikipedia

1024px-Old_Day_Level.png

'Old Day Level'


1024px-New_Day_Level.jpg

'New Day Level'


Anyone know where these are located? Are there New and Old levels, or are they one and the same? There also seems to be yet another adit (hidden behind a rock) in Porth Bach. I might go for a recce this afternoon as I need to be in Pwllheli this evening.
Click to expand...
There is a line at the top of the dark on the walls of the New Day Adit. This is the level it floods up to in wet conditions. This makes it a mine to be treated with some caution. There is not a lot of air space in flood and potentially some parts could sump.
 
davel said:
This is the 1914 25" map image I used for my location of the Old Day Level, which accords with my memory of the location and Bertie's map above.
View attachment 1292

As Jolyon and Torre says, what Bertie marks as "Trial Adit" is a small pipe set in concrete, one wonders what would happen if it ever becomes blocked.
Click to expand...
Water will find a way. Probably out through the New Day Adit as it's at about the same elevation. And I do not know of any other exits at that level.
 
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